tv Discussion CSPAN December 22, 2013 12:30am-1:16am EST
her into the rally, political rally where she was killed and after. that wasn't there. we saw videos, we saw pictures, we talked to numerous witnesses. we interviewed 250 people, and all of the people we interviewed saw no box formation, no elite force police protection, and that was the duty of the government. that was the duty of musharraf. >> former u.n. assistant secretary general herral do munoz on the international inquiry he led into the assassination of former pakistani prime minister benazir bhutto, sunday night at 9 on "after words." >> and coming in january, "in depth" with radio talk show host mark levin will take your questions for three hours sunday, january 5th, all part of booktv, weekend on c-span2. and online for this month's booktv book club, we want to know what your favorite books were in 2013. throughout the month join other
>> in a number of aspects of my life and constantly being available although i enjoy you on in yourself of. i appreciate it. i want to talk for 5920 minutes and i would like to start. my job with the n.y.p.d. and how we change my internal compass. i've had a strange occurrence with a young man in the book then i would like to delve into the people that i dealt with -- met with a and want to leave it with my sense of frustration the reason i left and the battle between my experiences of good people and the government
even to do those easy things well and the reason why i walked away. i never wanted to be a police officer i wanted to be a doctor. i took the and cat not too long ago i was watching gray's anatomy and i said i think i will take the m cap. she says nobody just thinks that they will. i did pretty well but unfortunately i did not getting in but i did not want to be a police officer but i talk about in childhood is not meant to be a sob story but the scars make us who we are a and i worship every pub to make me to am and enable me to see if there is real evil in the world and there is a perspective that does not
get lost but we had a household that was ravaged by a bad divorce and a family member who sought physical child abuse was inappropriate outlet for his internal ray j and when you witness that you feel as helpless as you have ever felt did your life when you are a nine year-old bartender old watching this happen and you know, there is nothing you can do it is disturbing and i found peace and serenity only in the police officers when they would show what this team to be the only thing this individual in our life that cause pain was afraid of. nothing else no man or woman that would scare him except if a blue uniform and i remember thinking i
documented in the book when it got out of control i remember seeing the police officer showing up house saying what a job. you are meeting people and world are colliding at their absolute lowest for me that was soloist the pain and fear in you can turn around like that and i released have to try pearl i started as an idealistic as they think we'll do but i tell the story of being on the street one night. doing the 6:00 p.m. shift we had t-shirts made up for radio station made up is a new station is the expression give us 10
minutes we give you though world the precinct was east new york brooklyn there was a drug war between the it rival projects like a turf war. something like 300 homicides the year before i had gotten there. to put that into perspective the entire city of baltimore had to a hundred this was one of 78 so it was the extremely tough area and a rude awakening for a young 20 year-old especially the idealist who thought he could change the world. i saw a young kid one night. maybe he was 10 or 11 but should not have been on the street the time i was out like midnight. for some reason i struck up a conversation with him and
i said what do want to do when you grow up? he looked at me quizzically as if the question baffled him he had never thought about what to do or what that meant. he clearly did not have an answer. a doctor? engineer? lawyer? what is your job? how do you make money? he said i want to be like a-z. dash i did he say jy-z? he was up-and-coming guy thought he wants to be jy-z. he said no. a-z. i had to think about it. it was a local drug dealer kid that was up punk but once in awhile put on a performance in the atrium in
the open area of the housing projects. it occurred to me almost the transformative moment that his america was not ours. no question he did not only not want to be jay-z he wanted to be a-z. that is staggering. i was almost okay with the other and i could not get this kid out of my mind. i live right over the hill and i could not get him out of my head. how is it is part of the york centrally located no more than 20 minutes from manhattan right off the jackie robinson parkway, but could not be more geographically suited for economic growth, what is
wrong? the big question is not why are there potholes' industry or grand auto larceny number in this precinct but what is wrong with this particular area? no one could lead to the big question. to the nuclear bomb go off here? this kid was no different different, not in a conversation that i was at nine or 10 yet his america was not mine. the a.d. it to be a doctor or author, in junior had never occurred to him. i have to have the rule -- a role to change not necessarily a role of politics as a candidate but to sparking interest of ideology, liberal versus
conservative libertarian verse says green the austrian school versus the chicago school. there has to be the answer a clearly that was not implemented here. and eventually the fed is how i found the secret service. i was reading a book and i would go into the fbi it was mine hunter it was about their profiling program i was studying neuro psychology in graduate school and i was explaining to this woman on a treadmill to was a police officer who had worked with the secret service. i was fascinated with the politics and ideology she said you need to check out the secret service. looking back it was there probably the wrong call. i should not have put myself in the process that i knew
was watering a.c. that would grow then sprout a tree to rupture the concrete digested not expect it to come a part of me. i thought politics, economic ideology is secondary and it was and i found the secret service and i love the job. without anybody knowing who you are but you get to live this life to be a part of government at the highest level. it was an incredible experience. we were at the prudential center? the doubles? when john course i was trying to get reelected he lost to chris christie. but i knew he would lose because we tried to fill the stadium they thought they would get 20,000 people when they got 8,000 i thought he
would lose bad. but i kept thinking what is wrong? what happened in the precinct? is a government-bond? in working with people from the white house literally on down to the administrative assistant from hhs always traveling around to different agencies they bring temporary staffers that everybody was so terrific to work with so i thought it cannot be a matter of personal incompetence of the men and women would work eight in the morning to midnight no one ever complained it just was the job a and the mission was clear. i went to afghanistan with president obama. i remember looking in the face of the delta force operator he has that
1,000 miles tear. he had some stories but they would have been fascinating. the staffer who was slightly out of touch from boggler mayor base asking those guys to leave their weapons i thought you ask them. there is no way i will do that. he did not. but i remember rekeying the delta force government, a military there such fascinating flux. what is going on? said tide went on a and i got more and more disconnected from what i
thought was a parasitic lifestyle. strictly personal. i looked at my neighbors we rigged a bad recession at the time and i was suffering no ill consequences at all. gas prices went up i had a government car, a gas card, my salary went up every year but no inflation adjustment i felt i had no skid in the cave. -- skadden the game. isn't it odd when you see our immigrant population i see the people who came here with nothing and then making sap -- six figures then randomly decided to open case of why we're not there risktaker any more we fell into the middle class apathy and let the country slowly
dissipate around us not only do we not duse's people ask me what can redo? icy blast the wrong question but what are you doing now? people say who is your congressman? they have no idea. think of the apathy in the midterm election it is not uncommon for 50 percent of the people not to vote. i thought i can't. i'm sorry i would rather die pour. might wife and i had a prolonged conversation their real consequences so going down to the cinco day meyer party and she turned to me
is that i would not talk you out of this? she said no. do it. reside. and on the way in she said you know, i was a classmate? she said it's because i'm pregnant. i thought have then puts a zero way to put the price on things my boss thought i was crazy but i walked out they have the glass door that is heavy even when it slams it would rock's old building. when i walked out not to be melodramatic last sound i ever heard because i knew was the last time that door would ever shot. i walked away. the longest of shots in
american history started with me and my dad i don't want to get into the politics but we lost a and it was an incredible experience. it taught me a lot about the system but i thought that i have already seen. i thought this is old hat but i've learned a lot. it is the process that is broken. i don't own the been traditionally what the general public sees, all of you haven't sold out. unless you have the money or a block of voters that you can move a representative figure direction the sold-out internally over taxpayer interests.
and if you don't you should why do we have these different law enforcement agencies of the alphabet soup? does anyone have a common-sense answer? i think about over age and over again how. so here is how the system works in were the cyrus needs to be sounded because as the bureaucracy grows when everyone is responsible to nobody is. that is how you get a situation like benghazi were ultimately they admit openly that we did not know that it went through the bureaucracy as if it isn't real people. the reason people with specific actions whether
being fried or credit card fraud there is no power in the government just the word no. when i can sit there as a federal agent and have jurisdiction with a crime you need investigated you need to come to me because i have monopoly power. it is in my best interest to maintain that relationship because you have the private money and when i leave i will ask for repayment. with money interest of everything is not doing your time it's when you leave. it is the dreaded carrousel but it is the same problem with the log beside. to have a specific aspects
of government including policy very rarely does your representative actually represent you. the process is simple. you can access and make your case if it isn't catastrophic to put up the smokescreen i will go for that piece of legislation not just preservation of my contacts in the private sector but maintain the access later. and maintaining access. as this bureaucracy grows you see this and which of the shares were up british red to the can and so were the bad decision were the american people have come to excepted.
every betty always uses apple because it is the iphones. [laughter] but god forbid it wants to launch a product if it failed catastrophically you would see decision making where everybody would be held accountable. i wrote as a foil to the other chapters i wrote about the boston bombing and benghazi and "fast & furious" as examples of what i just told you. think of the boston bombing. you can put yourself on google. you will get an e-mail if
your name appears on the internet. it is amazing. think of that years ago. you'd have to go to the library but those that travel there and back in the tourist information database he was identified and nobody thought there is anything wrong. or nobody followed up in the appropriate manner. does that not strike you as odd for a government that spends trillions of dollars nobody thought there is anything wrong? if it was the private sector jobs to be at stake as salaries and promotions would be at stake but yet nothing happens and for quite sure you it is not a reflection of the good people who act as our federal agents. i promise i never saw one who would not think it was
an active terrorist attack but nobody thinks anything of it because the bureaucracy grows it gets worse. what is the byproduct? wheezy bureaucratic efforts what they can stop through common-sense reform through the nsa. clutches to a blanket surveillance rather than looking at why do we have these federal agencies? and bring up another example :t the accountability review board where they stated they had a manpower problem and i contrast that with the raid on the gibson guitar factory importing wood from indonesia. you have u.s. government to pass this situation in benghazi and active conflict
zone, documented request for security over and over. they say there's a lot of bureaucracy but it does not bother anyone are strike them as odd we had a death to go rate they give send catarrh factory over imported would? priorities? really? the disease the to complain been suggestions going for the they take questions if we streamline these agencies as intelligence and internal affairs and one federal law enforcement operation segmented like the n.y.p.d. you could have cross training, and move people around and take a vantage of the economies of scale that the private sector does the industry space and promote faster, promotion can be economize we could save tons
of money in reallocate manpower to priorities. we cannot do that now. even in the secret service we have to put a request to go through channels to waste money just to get a guy with a gun to show what. we don't have to do that we can prioritize terrorism terrorism, organized crime, and reallocate efficiently and not worry about six agents breaking into gibson guitar to bust up the of would ring while the embassy in benghazi has no security. i find that unforgivable and in the of private sector with the profit motive to incentivize with greater productivity we could fix it but we don't have that in the government. remember what i said. the economic interest is always for you to retain as much power as you can because there is no power.
only be as a government official with the monopoly of that investigation to tell you no. you need me. when i create a need, i create a request later on in that will be my request later on. but we can fix that and it will take passionate people and i think it will take more people to speak out. right now there is a crisis of internal leadership i think people are afraid to leave but i speak to people all the time on the inside that are just as frustrated from the military or anywhere else. it will take a tidal wave of people speaking out to have effective change. i appreciate you listening and i will take your questions if you would like to read it later you will see what i was talking about for the last few chapters. thank you very much.
[applause] >> we will take questions. wait for the microphone and identify yourself as a courtesy. >> citizen at large. do easing part of the problem is a risk aversion is in our culture that whenever there is some tragedy, a multibillion-dollar lawsuits come out as the families of the victims? everyone feels obliged to maximize security so you could say i had these people watching and nothing happened but the civil war the enemy was just across the river. and during world war ii but
yet there was nowhere near the lockdown is seen as we try to prevent any sort of violence so do you think that mentality is part of the problem? >> i do but i think it is a much different environment as a function of technology to spread a dirty baum explosives exponentially and non-traditional weapons and frankly this social modeling before i went into the secret service was said graduate student faceted by psychology the ability to watch what another person does is almost a uniquely human behavior. why do i say that? you see the school shootings
no question in my mind the growth is a result of press coverage of the actual yvette that is created with a 24-hour news cycle, a facebook, of logging and to tweet. remember when we had been lauded in pakistan a gentleman who lived there that we did there repellent copters overhead before they landed so saturated with information worldwide in the tragic yvette has the capacity to set off a proliferation in cascade, so to the first point, are we a little hypersensitive? yes. but second, the environment is different. i write in the book the environment for tourism in counterterrorism is very dangerous.
i use the business model the traditional model was a franchise model. feet of it like mcdonald's you buy it as a franchisee. you have to buy the burgers and material can take your orders from the central but you operate your own store but you follow the propaganda that mcdonald's calls it marketing. that franchise model was dangerous but not as much as the sole proprietor model because it left a lot of bread crumbs i worked a lot of these cases federally i could not even get information on my own case they would redact data and it was my investigation.
i can carry a gun on airforce one that cannot get information on the guy i am investigating from another federal agency? it does not leave the breadcrumbs looking at 9/11 9/11, not qualitatively but flight school global trading sessions in multiple contacts that left a bright come -- a bread crumb behind the does not happen anymore they have very contact at all so they went to the internet the 24-hour propaganda machine to the pressure cookers to take upon themselves to create the bomb to shut down an entire city. i would argue the effects although not as spectacular were not nearly as devastating.
and the sole proprietor terrorists do not leave the breadcrumbs. were you going to do watch every american's traffic? that may be a silly question with the nsa but we are hypersensitive and it is largely a reflection of political correctness as well. i may libertarian at heart i believe every man and woman is a child of god but if someone says to look for a greenmail six 1/6 inches the city left to figure that as to why go after because of you in search another random race krieger culture people are offended as if he did something wrong just because i am looking for someone that i know attends a certain religious facility doesn't mean anything we
just follow the trail and it becomes more dangerous now because you get blanket surveillance with the nsa is silly and also blanket screening which is absurd. really? to esa? day you realize the economic productivity lost every year to screen 999 add of 1,000 people who did not even have a nail clipper? it is a waste. but the environment is a different. >> global affairs for the secretary-general -- general of united nations.
argument from me on that one. i of an avid constitutional conservative with a libertarian bet to you don't have a fidelity of a set of rules no way to argue otherwise but yes it is a global flight but i could only argue from my perspective of secret service. but some use the heavy handed approach globally that are not limited by the rules we have in this country that have the of flowback defect to make the environment worse not military but from law-enforcement i think some of the tactics are extremely effective in aluminate create internal propaganda later sometimes of law-enforcement honey works a lot better than vinegar in my experience.
>> merry christmas to all. >> merry christmas. >> i have a two-part question. as an active secret service agent but active duty why did you do not specifically a tent which is the real crooks of all of the problems that you mentioned article to section one of the united states constitution the deals with the qualifications to be president no person except a natural born citizen of the united states shall be president on the qualifications so may i ask why did you not deal with the greatest threat as an
officer as a domestic threat and international threat to america because right now we do have an unconstitutionally elected president and that poses the greatest threat not only to america but around the world >> that is so lots of part number one. [laughter] unfortunately it is not true. the president of united states was born in the united states. i have nothing else to say on that. i cannot argue with you on that. >> data standard you are
running for congress again can you talk about why do you want to give it into a body that only has 90 percent disapproval rating? i cannot too much into with but talking about approval ratings congress is funny with 9 percent approval by individual congressman they say i think he is great. if they no. it is funny you ask people sometimes i don't live in the district ironing in but i will eventually does that bother you? they save not really. what district? i don't know. people talk about it like it is not made of real people. they generally like their congressmen. those are not off it is
largely a function of policy decisions icy grave you get of lecher in the mail that slaps you in the face the you lost your health care makes it real and policy decisions don't have that effect if it is something like taxes is is your check bigger last year than the sheer? but to answer the larger question why i would choose to get involved, plato said if you refuse to get involved you are destined to be ruled by people lesser than yourself. what do you do? really? seven this room? we're all complainers. i am. not it a bad way but water
you doing? what are you doing? the world is changed by action action changes the world and i go back to the question what can we do? what are you doing now? nothing. what do you mean? you just let this happen? if you don't get involved to take a risk like that pakistan the subway owner who did not even speak english and figured out to make money what are you doing to change the process to make it a better tomorrow? the people don't tell you how yesterday's was terrible but now they have a better action for tomorrow and i have an obligation for those whose support a very nice lifestyle i have an obligation to give you
something back. believe me i tell you the financial penalty was long-lasting. if you thank you make money in books you are not. it was the ideological mission to use as the vehicle for your cause but if you thank you write a book to leave -- to make his $3 million i left behind you are added your mind. this is the greatest country on earth but it takes people of action and not just to get up and do something. >> one last question. we understand a lot of washington not just with the protection that your proposal to put some of those together to have another part of responsibility but how does that cross with pure libertarian view?
are you not centralizing too much power in some places rather them the check and balance that could give us? >> the power is already centralized there is already a monopoly power. to break that up, i will give you an example let's use the secret service so it makes a convenient example. you don't want to pay billions of dollars per year especially when taxpayers do with four free. if op if i do you have monopoly power over being fried, there is no power to me to say yes. i have to make you come to me now with the n.y.p.d. very centralized very few others have any power at all. the sheriff's are not
involved but if i go to you officer jones and i need you to tell the you say i a will not do it they just go to someone else. officers have said? there is endless evidence. so i would argue strongly there is already a monopoly power to centralize bureaucratically does not necessarily centralize the power but enables different avenues. it is hard to swallow but from the inside the redundancy is absurd. i remember literally the same building. to federal agencies. one had the distinct and separate offices. another that he did the
space. they rented and other office. you start to scratch your head. this is insane. told milton friedman the theory people are spending other people's money on other people either cost or quality matter. i would rather they spend other people's money on themselves because the lease the quality matters if i spent it that night by the best suit i can find but when you spend taxpayer money on other people equality does not matter either and that is ridiculous decision making you don't think there is waste in our budget? it is absurd how much waste literally. if i could add one more thing. on the other front i'm in to end the segmentation but the
lobby front that has been going on for yarns but the source of all of our problems there is a tax code if i could give you a tax break and not give it to the blue suit company give you the competitive advantage in the field that you don't have now you pay be back with the donee -- campaign donation you realize that ripple effect will supply data on thousands over decades? they think about how many value misjudgments because i could give you a tax break? it is no small item. why do you think go left fight so viciously because the flat tax? no.